Wow. So many call-backs here. Where to start? Martha's departure was wonderful. It was funny how I kept thinking despite all that was terrible about her situation, boy do I hate having to get up in the dark to catch an early flight. There's something so lonely and sad and cold about that pre-dawn drive even when I'm taking it. And Martha's "Don't be alone." I totally thought, as Selenak did, about Gregory's line to Elizabeth about not letting Philip make her soft. Right there, two different relationships and people. Martha wishes him to not be alone like she is, Gregory still wants Elizabeth away from Philip and reminds her her devotion to the cause and strength is where her true value lies.
Which makes me think that one of the many issues this brought up for Elizabeth was that. I loved how impossible P&E find it to come together on Martha. They still don't get where each other is coming from. Elizabeth sees Martha as Philip's Gregory, which makes her make that connection. That sends Philip off on the "disappointment" tangent because Martha isn't his Gregory.
I also wonder if she wasn't thinking about how, okay, Gregory chose his way to die so it wasn't up to Elizabeth. But Philip worked really hard to protect Martha. Elizabeth's worldview didn't allow her to do that for Gregory.
It also called up Philip's earlier frustration in EST talking about the bullies--afterwards he says to Sandra "I just feel BAD." Like he's angry at everyone pointing out how he was right to beat the kid up (not understanding he killed him), how it wasn't so bad. But over and over--loudly--he seems to be trying to tell people his issue is more about the principle. It wasn't that he'd lost Martha, specifically, and felt sad about that. It was that he felt badly about ruining the lives of many human beings--Martha, Gene, Martha's parents. So even while Elizabeth is confronting him openly about Martha she doesn't know he's slipping on a disguise to visit GENE. His remorse just keeps getting driven more underground. The more she demands he straighten up the more secret layers he retreats to.
I also love how Elizabeth still can't talk about Martha without sounding condescending because it's important to her not to put Martha on her level (not just as a wife but as an soldier). Loved how her "she's simple" and "you can talk to her about this stuff" totally echoes the audience's praise of Martha, and how Philip rejects it by saying no, she's not simple. She's complicated. You and everyone else underestimate her. Basically, Martha is not just an accessory or little buddy to Philip who's valuable because of what she provides for him. She was a person just as complex and important and valuable as the spies.
Meanwhile, I think Gabriel's caught that bug too (worse than Glanders!). For the second time he brings up the Purge and his own regrets. The Russian characters are kind of splitting into the ones dealing with this and the "Boo-hoo" crowd. He had to send his own friend to the gulag/death...for what? (I know he was actually defending his actions as necessary, but he's conflicted about it. He and Philip are I think moving out of the adolescent stage of their relationship.)
Elizabeth seemed so desperate to get herself back to that easier pre-pilot time. This whole ep she reminded me so much of S1 when she threw Philip out, and it was fitting they essentially had the same fight about Philip being disappointing/American/soft. Her attempts to shout him into submission didn't work (Dude's been defying the actual KGB for a few seasons now and is way to stubborn to roll over on this stuff)...
...but she laid a much more effective law down on Paige which I admit I found pretty satisfying. Sorry it's a sucky situation, but the reality is the reality here. Paige put her parents' lives in the hands of this guy and when somebody shares a deadly secret with you you have to keep them close. This, btw, was exactly what I envisioned happening when she told. Not because I'm great at predicting where this show will go at all, but because realistically speaking this is the only logical result of her telling that secret. Either she had to destroy her family by telling or be stuck with this guy forever.
It was just really cathartic hearing her lay out the facts--and interestingly, what she was saying was actually pretty much what Philip said early on. She has to think about Pastor Tim's feelings now, not her own. I loved Elizabeth talking about her trying to be precious about them (which also made me think damn, this woman has really developed a command of English!) while Paige is still--STILL!--acting like her feelings are so important. Sure Elizabeth was probably also acting out her anger over Philip, but it was earned here. I've never enjoyed Elizabeth so much as when she was directing Paige to find more shit to volunteer for at that goddamned church and then come home and report. Hope that moment of relief on the phone that one night was worth it!
And again I admit I have very limited sympathy for Paige's woefulness about it in the end. Adults have to fake it, Paige. Someone on Twitter said seeing Paige stuck in Pastor Tim hell was one of the best payoffs in TV history and I kind of agree.
The Stan scenes are so much more interesting post-Glanders and Philip's groveling apology. His "buck up" speech to him was kind of great considering what Martha was facing--and it was also a speech to himself, I guess.
That just made me think, actually, how Elizabeth has these fits of jealousy with Philip, not really liking him to be too attached to people like Martha or even Kimmie or EST ("He won't listen to us, Gabriel. He needs a hotel room full of STRANGERS to talk to!"). Then there's Stan who threatened him physically for hanging out with Sandra, a person he seemed to be able to talk to. So Philip again has these two people he supports a lot who are angry at him for seeming too dedicated to someone else. Then Stan, at least, ends the ep having Philip there to listen to his problems again. Even problems about Sandra. That put Philip back in his place!
Elizabeth, I will say, is much more supportive than Stan. We see her truly trying with Philip and often succeeding. Just in this ep she couldn't do it.
Elizabeth's tearing down of EST, btw. Some people saw her not trying to be mean just as she wasn't trying to cut down Martha by calling her simple, but I disagree. I thought her whole lead up about how she "sees what he likes" in EST had the same tone she used back in S1 to lead up to her Irina revelation. She couldn't wait to point out the pyramid scheme of it all.
She's right about EST objectively, but her reaction to it reminds me of her reaction to the church. She just sees it as a scam for gullible people and can't take the step to understand that even something silly can be valuable to someone. When Philip said "You don't get it" she correctly saw that as an EST trick to make people buy more, but I think Philip honestly meant it more in terms of what he was getting out of it--though it was the one time he really slipped into anything like EST-talk.
It reminded me of one time when I went to a silly New Age-y type thing and wound up having this great epiphany that was really helpful and practical. When I tried to tell a friend about it she just could not stop railing about her contempt for the whole idea. And I wasn't offended at her criticism--I didn't actually believe in the stuff and I even thought I understood why she'd be sensitive to it. It was just frustrating, though, because no matter how clearly I thought I made it that I wasn't pushing any woo-woo, I was just explaining the very practical, helpful thing I discovered and saying the context was funny, she couldn't let me say it. With Paige Elizabeth only found that when she decided Paige was seeking what she would really find in the Cause in the wrong place.
Of course, Elizabeth wasn't just putting it down. I think she was truly threatened and infuriated by what she heard there. Elizabeth loves her cage! In fact, someone pointed out that she later crapped on EST at Gabriel's safehouse, which looks like a prison and has grillwork on the windows, and Philip then walked out of it. (And Gabriel, apparently, walked out of frame leaving Elizabeth alone in the prison--then later Lisa's house also had grill on the windows.)
Also liked Henry's little complaints about his dad not being home and Philip coming there. I continue to disagree with some people who think Martha was some kind of domestic respite for Philip, like when his homelife was bad he got comfort from Martha. I just can't imagine how he got comfort from this woman whose life he was destroying, or how he wanted time *away* from his children to be domestic. Sure he'd stomp off there when he was angry at Elizabeth, but he loves his family.
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timeasmymeasure
Sistermagpie's thoughts on first watch David Copperfield
Date: 2016-05-05 06:08 pm (UTC)Which makes me think that one of the many issues this brought up for Elizabeth was that. I loved how impossible P&E find it to come together on Martha. They still don't get where each other is coming from. Elizabeth sees Martha as Philip's Gregory, which makes her make that connection. That sends Philip off on the "disappointment" tangent because Martha isn't his Gregory.
I also wonder if she wasn't thinking about how, okay, Gregory chose his way to die so it wasn't up to Elizabeth. But Philip worked really hard to protect Martha. Elizabeth's worldview didn't allow her to do that for Gregory.
It also called up Philip's earlier frustration in EST talking about the bullies--afterwards he says to Sandra "I just feel BAD." Like he's angry at everyone pointing out how he was right to beat the kid up (not understanding he killed him), how it wasn't so bad. But over and over--loudly--he seems to be trying to tell people his issue is more about the principle. It wasn't that he'd lost Martha, specifically, and felt sad about that. It was that he felt badly about ruining the lives of many human beings--Martha, Gene, Martha's parents. So even while Elizabeth is confronting him openly about Martha she doesn't know he's slipping on a disguise to visit GENE. His remorse just keeps getting driven more underground. The more she demands he straighten up the more secret layers he retreats to.
I also love how Elizabeth still can't talk about Martha without sounding condescending because it's important to her not to put Martha on her level (not just as a wife but as an soldier). Loved how her "she's simple" and "you can talk to her about this stuff" totally echoes the audience's praise of Martha, and how Philip rejects it by saying no, she's not simple. She's complicated. You and everyone else underestimate her. Basically, Martha is not just an accessory or little buddy to Philip who's valuable because of what she provides for him. She was a person just as complex and important and valuable as the spies.
Meanwhile, I think Gabriel's caught that bug too (worse than Glanders!). For the second time he brings up the Purge and his own regrets. The Russian characters are kind of splitting into the ones dealing with this and the "Boo-hoo" crowd. He had to send his own friend to the gulag/death...for what? (I know he was actually defending his actions as necessary, but he's conflicted about it. He and Philip are I think moving out of the adolescent stage of their relationship.)
Elizabeth seemed so desperate to get herself back to that easier pre-pilot time. This whole ep she reminded me so much of S1 when she threw Philip out, and it was fitting they essentially had the same fight about Philip being disappointing/American/soft. Her attempts to shout him into submission didn't work (Dude's been defying the actual KGB for a few seasons now and is way to stubborn to roll over on this stuff)...
...but she laid a much more effective law down on Paige which I admit I found pretty satisfying. Sorry it's a sucky situation, but the reality is the reality here. Paige put her parents' lives in the hands of this guy and when somebody shares a deadly secret with you you have to keep them close. This, btw, was exactly what I envisioned happening when she told. Not because I'm great at predicting where this show will go at all, but because realistically speaking this is the only logical result of her telling that secret. Either she had to destroy her family by telling or be stuck with this guy forever.
It was just really cathartic hearing her lay out the facts--and interestingly, what she was saying was actually pretty much what Philip said early on. She has to think about Pastor Tim's feelings now, not her own. I loved Elizabeth talking about her trying to be precious about them (which also made me think damn, this woman has really developed a command of English!) while Paige is still--STILL!--acting like her feelings are so important. Sure Elizabeth was probably also acting out her anger over Philip, but it was earned here. I've never enjoyed Elizabeth so much as when she was directing Paige to find more shit to volunteer for at that goddamned church and then come home and report. Hope that moment of relief on the phone that one night was worth it!
And again I admit I have very limited sympathy for Paige's woefulness about it in the end. Adults have to fake it, Paige. Someone on Twitter said seeing Paige stuck in Pastor Tim hell was one of the best payoffs in TV history and I kind of agree.
The Stan scenes are so much more interesting post-Glanders and Philip's groveling apology. His "buck up" speech to him was kind of great considering what Martha was facing--and it was also a speech to himself, I guess.
That just made me think, actually, how Elizabeth has these fits of jealousy with Philip, not really liking him to be too attached to people like Martha or even Kimmie or EST ("He won't listen to us, Gabriel. He needs a hotel room full of STRANGERS to talk to!"). Then there's Stan who threatened him physically for hanging out with Sandra, a person he seemed to be able to talk to. So Philip again has these two people he supports a lot who are angry at him for seeming too dedicated to someone else. Then Stan, at least, ends the ep having Philip there to listen to his problems again. Even problems about Sandra. That put Philip back in his place!
Elizabeth, I will say, is much more supportive than Stan. We see her truly trying with Philip and often succeeding. Just in this ep she couldn't do it.
Elizabeth's tearing down of EST, btw. Some people saw her not trying to be mean just as she wasn't trying to cut down Martha by calling her simple, but I disagree. I thought her whole lead up about how she "sees what he likes" in EST had the same tone she used back in S1 to lead up to her Irina revelation. She couldn't wait to point out the pyramid scheme of it all.
She's right about EST objectively, but her reaction to it reminds me of her reaction to the church. She just sees it as a scam for gullible people and can't take the step to understand that even something silly can be valuable to someone. When Philip said "You don't get it" she correctly saw that as an EST trick to make people buy more, but I think Philip honestly meant it more in terms of what he was getting out of it--though it was the one time he really slipped into anything like EST-talk.
It reminded me of one time when I went to a silly New Age-y type thing and wound up having this great epiphany that was really helpful and practical. When I tried to tell a friend about it she just could not stop railing about her contempt for the whole idea. And I wasn't offended at her criticism--I didn't actually believe in the stuff and I even thought I understood why she'd be sensitive to it. It was just frustrating, though, because no matter how clearly I thought I made it that I wasn't pushing any woo-woo, I was just explaining the very practical, helpful thing I discovered and saying the context was funny, she couldn't let me say it. With Paige Elizabeth only found that when she decided Paige was seeking what she would really find in the Cause in the wrong place.
Of course, Elizabeth wasn't just putting it down. I think she was truly threatened and infuriated by what she heard there. Elizabeth loves her cage! In fact, someone pointed out that she later crapped on EST at Gabriel's safehouse, which looks like a prison and has grillwork on the windows, and Philip then walked out of it. (And Gabriel, apparently, walked out of frame leaving Elizabeth alone in the prison--then later Lisa's house also had grill on the windows.)
Also liked Henry's little complaints about his dad not being home and Philip coming there. I continue to disagree with some people who think Martha was some kind of domestic respite for Philip, like when his homelife was bad he got comfort from Martha. I just can't imagine how he got comfort from this woman whose life he was destroying, or how he wanted time *away* from his children to be domestic. Sure he'd stomp off there when he was angry at Elizabeth, but he loves his family.